Advice

[jennifire]

I have just handed all my NVQ 3 work in and it is being marked so I am looking at doing the foundation degree but I will need to find some funding, will i get chance to have much funding if i already work full time? Also, what will I be able to do with a foundation degree that I can't already do with my NVQ 3? Its a lot of money for the course and I don't want to waste it to find that I don't benefit from doing the course!

[Heidi]

Originally Posted by jennifire

I have just handed all my NVQ 3 work in and it is being marked so I am looking at doing the foundation degree but I will need to find some funding, will i get chance to have much funding if i already work full time? Also, what will I be able to do with a foundation degree that I can't already do with my NVQ 3? Its a lot of money for the course and I don't want to waste it to find that I don't benefit from doing the course!

A foundation degree is a level 5 - so it depends what you want to do with that level. Tutu has just replied to another member saying that students just gaining a level 3 should wait 2 years before embarking on a level 4; explaining that the CWDC have stopped the NVQ4 as practitoners were making a mockery of it, just leaping from one level to another without practising and reinforcing their knowledge.
It does depend on the individual though, how long they have been in the sector. If you are thinking of doing any kind of degree, it will require a lot more work. For each module you are expected to often put between 100 - 200 hours of research and study and also expected to work/study weekends for two years. Hard work and hard on you and your family. It is expensive with everything you will need to buy i.e. paper, ink, memory sticks, books, travel, time etc
It's not impossible, but as you say, you need to know all the ins and outs to weigh it all up.
A level 5 will give you a senior practitioner post, a leading practitoner post is level 6 -+ Early Years Professional Status.
Research suggests (at present) that most EYPs are given only 50p an hour extra after up to 5 years of study.

[tutu]

completely agree you shouldnt be even thinking about a level 5 fd until you have worked at a level 3 for at least 2 years. good colleges wouldn't touch you either. Ou will of course but then they take anyone with the funds which is why a lot of employers dont reckon it!
you need to embed your learning gain experience and develop. when you have been doing that for 18 months or so you should then do an academic writing course as writing at degree level is utterly different from reflective writing. the study skills are advanced and necessary. these courses arent designed to prepare you for the next level they are to stretch you when you have achieved that level professionally. AND a future employer will dismiss training that has been rushed through. work read learn then do a next course.

[Heidi]

Our answers do sound harsh, but I totally agree with Tutu. I've seen a lot of students drop out. The drive is to push or 'upskill' everyone and some will take students on the course with 'O' level Maths and English -and most struggle if they have not obtained 'A' levels - a degree is a big jump from 'A' levels. Quite a few are then advised by the university they attend to improve their English if they wish to stay on. This does not apply to everyone, but a degree does need an awful lot of thought.

[akel1111]

A foundation degree is available to those with a level 3 qualification. It begins at Level 4 and progresses to level 5. I agree that that a 'bridging' course into level 4 is extremely helpful, especially if your level 3 qualification is in the form of an NVQ.

The financial gains in the Children's workforce are never large however far you you further your knowledge or qualifications. The children are the main people who will reap the benefits of your further learning and isn't that why you work with children in the first place?

[Heidi]

Originally Posted by akel1111

A foundation degree is available to those with a level 3 qualification. It begins at Level 4 and progresses to level 5. I agree that that a 'bridging' course into level 4 is extremely helpful, especially if your level 3 qualification is in the form of an NVQ.

The financial gains in the Children's workforce are never large however far you you further your knowledge or qualifications. The children are the main people who will reap the benefits of your further learning and isn't that why you work with children in the first place?

I totally agree with you, but I feel practitioners should be informed that they may not gain a penny more. Some are fortunate (perhaps no mortgage etc), others expect more money after studying long and hard, and some need to earn more money and think gaining higher levels will help them achieve it. The sector is very often poorly paid, but very rewarding.

[akel1111]

Originally Posted by Heidi

I totally agree with you, but I feel practitioners should be informed that they may not gain a penny more. Some are fortunate (perhaps no mortgage etc), others expect more money after studying long and hard, and some need to earn more money and think gaining higher levels will help them achieve it. The sector is very often poorly paid, but very rewarding.

Another problem with EYP status is that as well as there being no financial gain, there is no actual seniority invoved in this post. For example I know of nurseries where the EYP is a nursery officer whose job it is to research new initiatives and help advise staff (including the manager) on how to implement them. This is on top of their daily duties.

The government really needs to ensure that there is at least some financial gain in EYP status or we will not have people having the incentive to achieve further qualifications. But who knows? With the new government perhaps EYP status will cease to exist.

[pip squeak]

I agree with all your comments especially the last one from ake 111.

I am also seeing people with EYP status not being given job/financial reward to benefit the status. Also agree people are being rushed through too quickly as I am also seeing qualified EYP's/FD's without the confidence to work at the qualification level, including managing and guiding a staff team.

At the moment the childcare workforce has a number of people qualified without the experience or confidence to carry out the job and who is driving this no stop qualification approach without breathing space .............. ??

[Heidi]

Toally agree with everyone that has given advice. I'm not sure if Jennifire was expecting our answers to her very first posting (she only asked poor thing!).
I've also found when interviewing, everyone seems to have 'everything' these days but most know very little. Gone are the days when people applied with a PPA (as it was in those days) diploma and it spoke volumes. Having said that there are still some very good practitioners around who are willing to build up their knowledge slowly over the years. I for one are lucky enough to have fantastic and knowledgeable staff.

[pip squeak]

Point taken Heidi - thanks for putting us back on track

Jennifire - what we are saying is make sure you give yourself time to put your level 3 into practice, that way you will find an FD or EYP qualification easier to achieve. Get as much training under your belt as possible.

It is a leap from level 3 to these two qualifications - take your time and you could find a number of jobs out there, within the childcare workforce, which will give you choice in the job market.

Good luck